Comments

Miro, I believe that using common sense is in place here, as I already said, you have got bot trigger source code, so you have got “documentation” to this SaveBotData bot.

You have got Visual Studio installed. If I publicly released this bot, I did so mainly for those who want to learn betfair bot programming, so including Bfexplorer BOT SDK and all my publicly available bots, they have got a lot of bot code to learn from and to build on this code, its own betfair bots.

Therefore please open Visual Studio, open Bfexplorer BOT SDK solution, and open this bot source code, then you can learn how this bot saves bot’s bet position only for those bots inherited from SelectionBot.

My common sense says to me that you should manage to do so, right? You installed Visual Studio, so you must know how to use it, otherwise, my common sense says, you did not install something you have no idea how to use it, right?

The bot code is very simple, and you can see what method is actually used to detect when SaveBotData bot needs to save a bet position of the bot that has just ended its execution:

(market.RunningBots :> INotifyCollectionChanged).CollectionChanged.AddHandler SaveBotDataHandler

Ok, you will say you have got no idea about bot programming, but even you are not a software developer, I believe you are able to read some English words, right?

market - running bots - collection changed - save bot data

You said you use Repeat Until bot. Unfortunately, for this type of bot your SaveBotData bot will not detect that your action bot ended its execution, so will not save its bet position to CSV file.

It seems this article is not more about bots, but more about quarrelling who is right or wrong, who has and use a common sense or not.

Last days I visited some other forum of my competitors offering betfair automation. Frankly to say, sometimes I had no idea about what people were asking for, and I was surprised that even simple operations like closing bet position or placing bets has to be done by combinations of different rules, or settings and a lot of things could not be done at all. I was surprised by people’s understanding of those rules and features; actually no one has been complaining that something cannot be done, or the way how it is done or implemented. All users have base understanding, some way they grasped a common sense in using app features,  and I must say that those features are a lot of complicated comparing to bfexplorer ones, that is at least my opinion.

Back to the common sense in using bfexplorer features. If you start a bot, in the Output view you can read the message: The bot XY has been started. When a bot ends its execution, in the Output view you can read the message: The bot XY ended.

The above mentioned fact is important, mainly in the context how the SaveBotData bot works. The bot detects when a bot is removed from the market bot collection, and at the moment saves its bet position.

The bot Repeat Until, or Chain Execution bot, execute its action bot/s internally without exposing them to bfexplorer. Bfexplorer, the Market Bots view knows only about the Repeat Until, or Chain Execution bot, but nothing about internally executed bots, and you could learn this common knowledge just by observing what bot writes to the Output view, or what bots are presented in the Market Bots view.

Miro, so it is again just about a common sense in using bfexplorer features, some way you still did not grasp it when using bfexplorer, and in this case it is really quite simple, how the bot SaveBotData can save bet position of market running bots, if those action bots are not presented in Market Bots view?

Please, read this:

market - running bots - collection changed - save bot data

Well... I explain it for myself.

"Do you know dude without common sense that it works only if you run the action bots directly on selections?
If you run full automated trading solution (example: 1. Execute Bots, 2. Execute on Selections, 3. Repeat Until and finaly action bot 4. Place Bet and Close Selection Bet Position...)

SaveDataBot doesnt work."

-----------------------------

PS: I dont need any modification

Where is a Show Selections Trading Indicators bot?

I have the latest version of Bfexplorer...

Eduardo, you use my replies to issues you do not care to investigate if they were right or wrong. If you did read articles and watch videos I replied to, you would learn that I was/am right, and all what user/Miro needed was to use a common sense to solve his issues, the issues which were not actually problems with bfexplorer features, but his wrong approach of using bfexplorer.

Miro did not download the latest version of bfexplorer and/or custom script I built for him, I had to change bfexplorer interface to make available some new features, his custom built script could use, and without latest version of both the script and bfexplorer his bot scripts simply did not work as required.

If you would read article comments you would had found Miro’s reply where he finally understood that he was wrong, but of course he did not apologize for what he said, but he said:

“Is it possible create public folder with free scripts? You change some code in Bfe, old scripts dont work, and look for them in the forum is not easy...”

Every time I updated his scripts I said to him, download scripts and install latest version of bfexplorer, I communicated with him through emails as well. He is Czech and was easier for him to communicate in his mother’s language, so we discussed bot script development not only in this forum.

Well, yes as an excuse he created a list of custom bot scripts I built for him, I understood it and did not reply to this issue anymore.

Stefan say:

"Miro, I already mentioned words about using common sense when replying on your other forum post, and we can actually see it now on your video."

"I would really suggest you to not doing something what it beyond your possibilities"

Miro say:

"Frankly, I do not mind. I make an idiot of yourself you explain function and logic of bots to others...

Someone else?"

Stefan say:

"Eduardo, I do not think bfexplorer is complicated, you must know what you want to do"

"Eduardo, The main problem is really what I said before. You must know how you want to use bfexplorer feature/s for your trading, and frankly to say I do not think you have an idea how you would use them."

I know what I want to do, but my strategies are complicated and I do not think this can be done with BFexplorer, because it would have access to live statistics.

..................................................................................................................................................

Thank you for your sincerity and your encouragement!!!!

I think that is not good strategy to disparage anyone.

Amigo Stefan:

You say:

"Just go to your last article Button: "Hedge the entire market". I still have no idea what you wanted to say with this article, and I asked you three times just to confirm one think: Is bfexplorer showing correct profit balance or not?"

I say that Bfexplore show correct profit balance. The other, App also shows proper balance.

The difference is that BFexplorer included in the Hedge button, the balance of all the results with open bet. The other app only shows the balance with active open bets.

But when you push the button Hedge two apps do the same operations, the two try to lay @ 1000. Beware, if the lay is by stake <2, because they'll match your bet @ 1000 (odd trap) and lose 2 €.
I recommend always close result to result to avoid surprises.

On Site Map you can find Donate web page, donate at least 10 GBP and I will give you Professional subscription plan for 1 month at time you will want to use it.

I do not think bfexplorer is complicated, you must know what you want to do, just have a look at on this video, where I show how I run my testing bot: Show Selections Trading Indicators. There is just one parameter IntervalUpdating, I set for 30 seconds, and that is all.

The main problem is really what I said before. You must know how you want to use bfexplorer feature/s for your trading, and frankly to say I do not think you have an idea how you would use them.

Just go to your last article Button: "Hedge the entire market". I still have no idea what you wanted to say with this article, and I asked you three times just to confirm one think: Is bfexplorer showing correct profit balance or not? This question implies answer that geektoy app does not show correct profit balance, as you compared bfexplorer to this one.

http://pasteboard.co/jONn6YG.jpg

You say:

"From what I can say reading your low resolution images is that geektoy is totally wrong, you opened bet position on 0 – 0, 0 – 1, 1 - 0 , 1 – 1, 1 – 2, and 2 – 0. On some bets your close your bet position and some bet/s were left only with back bet. The current score, as we can see it on the middle image is 2 – 0, there is lowest back/lay odds on this selection 9.4.

Now explain me for god sake, how is it possible that geektoy shows your current bet position on this market as 0.93 loss only, when all your other bets already lost (0 – 0, 0 – 1, 1 - 0 , 1 – 1, 1 – 2) so your bet position on 2 – 0 which was in profit for 2.40 could not cover all your losses on other selections."

In the picture the value of the Hedge corresponds with the result 1-0. Also in the picture, it does not appear Back 2-1, giving benefit.

I thank you let me write in Spanish right for that, from the forum, it is easy to translate.

Yo te agradezco que tú me permitas escribir en correcto español para que, desde el foro, sea fácil traducirlo.

Eduardo, yesterday you sent me email asking me why I deleted images from your article, I replied to you that I did not delete anything, and I asked what you meant by your article, as I can read only the article title.

Today you posted article again with your images as well. You know bfexplorer and you know geektoy app too, because you used it as etalon and compared it bfexplorer.

I explained how bfexplorer calculates market profit balance and that to the calculation are included all open bet positions. In one of your images there are really big discrepancies, so I ask again:

Did you make your own calculation to actually verify which profit balance is correct? Because you blame that bfexplorer shows wrong numbers, and differences are quite huge, bfexplorer shows -5.18 loss and geektoy shows only -0.93 loss.

From what I can say reading your low resolution images is that geektoy is totally wrong, you opened bet position on 0 – 0, 0 – 1, 1 - 0 , 1 – 1, 1 – 2, and 2 – 0. On some bets your close your bet position and some bet/s were left only with back bet. The current score, as we can see it on the middle image is 2 – 0, there is lowest back/lay odds on this selection 9.4.

Now explain me for god sake, how is it possible that geektoy shows your current bet position on this market as 0.93 loss only, when all your other bets already lost (0 – 0, 0 – 1, 1 - 0 , 1 – 1, 1 – 2) so your bet position on 2 – 0 which was in profit for 2.40 could not cover all your losses on other selections.

I really think that bfexplorer number is correct, all what I ask you to explain what you actually meant by your artcle.

If English is problem for you then why you do not use Spanish, but please write it in correct Spanish without misspelling, so using google/bing translator will give me meaningful translation.

I actually do not care in what language you post here on bfexplorer forum. All I need is to get some feedback on bfexplorer features, and if there are some problems, I can solve them very quickly.

The forum is knowledge base as well, for other bfexplorer users, so next time when some geektoy expert will use bfexplorer and will complain about the same problem, I will know if it is really some issue in bfexplorer or geektoy implementation is totally wrong.

 Stefan:

I understand you question. But I did not say that bfexplorer shows wrong profit balance number. I have say: "Why this discrepancy in the "hedge the entire market" between the two softwares?"

I'm not qualified to tell you that your Hedge button miscalculate.

I think it's more a matter of habit and knowledge of trading.

I would never use the Hedge button on the CS market with a goal scored.

My intention was that you will explain the differences to beginners, because I understand them but I have great difficulty to express it in English.

Sorry for the misunderstanding

Eduardo, you wrote this article and stated your problem saying that bfexplorer shows wrong profit balance number.

So I repeat my question again: Did you actually make your math to check which results are correct, if bfexplorer shows correct number or the other app?

I think the other app shows wrong numbers. Do you understand my question?

Stefan:

Thank you very much for your video, is quite useful. Your videos are opened my eyes to the possibilities of your App.

In the market of CS always close my trade result to result to avoid problems.

For instance:

You say:

"BFexplorer shows for 0-0 selection balance -9.88 profit, well of course unrealistic outcomes but it is still valid if you would manage to close position bet on 0-0 by laying 0.13 at Euro 1000 odds."

If I do what you indicate lose € 2, because as the lay bet under 2 €, offered € 2 to 1000 and would equal  with the trap odds of 0-0. For that reason only I do trading on assets results.

Edurado, did you actually make your math on examples you showed us in the article? I think the other app actually shows wrong market profit balance. It is hardly to see on your pictures what bets you placed and what is actually correct profit balance number.

The profit balance number is meant to be a current profit you can close your bet position on entire market.

For instance if you back 0 - 0 for 10 Euro at 12.5 and 1 - 0 for 10 Euro at 7.8 odds, and later if home team scores and is 1 – 0, it is clear that you lost your bet on 0 – 0, so 10 Euro loss influences outcome on other selections. Bfexplorer shows for 0 – 0 selection profit balance -9.88, well of course unrealistic outcomes but it is still valid if you would manage to close bet position on 0 – 0 by laying 0.13 Euro at 1000 odds.

So losing 10 Euro on 0 – 0 means that you would be able to close your bet position on entire market only when sum of winners on other selections is greater than 10 Euro.

In the above example it means that I would be in profit only when match score is still 1 - 0 and lay for 1 – 0 is lower than 3.9.

Can others trading on football correct score market confirm that fact?

The difference in profit balance is because bfexplorer calculates profit balance on all open bet positions and for bet positions there is no offer on one side, it takes the opposite price to offer hedge bet.

On bet positions with offer it takes current offered price to close bet position.
The question is now what is better solution?

Is the other app calculating the profit hedge position only on selections you can close? If yes and goal will be scored on selection you have no position open, then you definitely lose, and then what the other app will show as profit balance on the market?

In correct score market you can simply hide selections without any lay offer, so showing only selections with possible outcome, to close bet position use close bet position on selection button as it is nonsense to try to close bet position on selections which are already not possible outcome of the match.

Hi Stefan:

Congratulations for your new indicators. I think they're very useful. I guess you can not add this option to basic BFE.

It might be interesting, as I mentioned, provide a semi-professional BFE, including some bots for 10-12GBP. So we not pay for other software that complements yours.

I think paying, Community Euro, 30 + 10 + Vat, €45-50 / month for BFE when only going to use a bot to stop loss and other for indicators and other for to be first in queue. BFE professional is impressive, is the best, but is only accessible to 5-10% of users due to their complexity.

Done - http://bfexplorer.net/Community/ForumContent/97#List of custom scripts - Execute Trigger Bot

Is it possible create public folder with free scripts?

http://bfexplorer.net/Content/Downloads/Triggers/...

You change some code in Bfe, old scripts dont work, and look for them in the forum is not easy...

Ilya, betfair api subscription is generated automatically, but in your case I did not realize that after switching your subscription to Free Professional in the next activation period there will be checked if you posted at least 5 articles or forum post on bfexplorer web site, therefore you were asked to subscribe as not fulfilling these conditions.

It is just coincidence, because when paying for Basic subscription, you still had active betfair api access from your trial period, so new subscription was not created, lesson learnt.

I will add to the user menu the subscription status web page, so anyone would be able to check his/her subscription status.

Please, explain me anybody why CSV file has only 1 row and how I can save every bot cycle on the market?

Frankly, I do not mind. I make an idiot of yourself you explain function and logic of bots to others...

Someone else?